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 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion

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How would you rate "Stowaway" ?
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PostSubject: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 12, 2011 5:46 pm

Promo trailer
Spoiler:
 

Press release
Spoiler:
 

Promo pictures
Spoiler:
 

Sneak Peeks
Spoiler:
 

*

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 1:26 am

Bump for show discussion.

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:32 am

I'm pleased to see Peter and I have the same opinion of Bell. And fate. And I loved Josh's growling that he wants his Olivia back! Nice to see some healthy anger there, and some forthrightness and action. For all the attention lavished on Torv, there's Josh making sense out of a scene, making the characters feel human and believable and normal... have you all noticed that he's the heart of the show? (And not just in a steampunk-vitrine way?)

As a spinoff-handoff, which is what this felt like, it worked; though this storyline gets the iron claw award for overwrought metaphor. Yes, I can see the foreshadowing of Peter having to be somewhere to keep people from dying.

Lincoln was begging to get hired on... I did love Astrid being
grossed out by Bell, that was smarmy, wasn't it? I can see why Nina
turned Bell down!

The dope scenes just feel really tired now.

I can see Peter and his sidekick Lincoln solving cases together........... though I'd so much rather have Peter and Olivia together as themselves. How about Lincoln and Astrid? They could be Fringe Team B, in the spinoff, and then Peter and Olivia could cross paths with them from time to time from Fringe Original.

Note to BR..... you'd get less crankiness out of the science-minded end of your viewership if you let the machine story finish without so much fate/destiny/meaning claptrap. To quote my favorite character " It's not even science!"

So--since Bell is a scheming monster---a soul vampire!-, who used Olivia, what do you think that means (if anything) about him telling Olivia she needs to keep Peter by her side? Is that because he wants to use Peter for his own purposes?

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Last edited by Elliot on Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:38 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : afterthoughts!)
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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:46 am

Ahhhh.

+5 I LOVED seeing Lincoln. Peter and him seemed to enjoy working together.
I wouldn't mind if he joined the team, as a lab assistant. (Rather than a new female-sortofJessup-agent.)

+1 I must say, it is disturbing to hear Anna talk like this..... and loved how Peter kept avoiding looking at Belllivia during the episode.

-1 The case was nice, though the storyboard could have been better.

48h is a long time !!!

+1 Peter saying he doesn't believe in fate. HA. In your face, Belly.

+2 Bell flirting with Astrid.... Oh GOD. I couldn't stop imagining what was thinking Lee during the magnets on the wrist scene.
Lincoln : *Oh my, they're lesbians ?*

+1
Broyles finding the room under the carpet : it's a small thing, but I appreciate that he's the one who found it. Otherwise it would have felt as he was just hanging around in the room, while waiting for the others to find everything for him.

+1
Walter and Bell finishing each other's sentences was cool, I love we got to see how it was when they were working together.
-2 Although I didn't appreciate that Bell was smoking - it's Olivia's body for freakingoddmansake. You don't do what you want with her body.

Olivia in one of Walter's (Peter's?) wardrobe....

+1 The last scene was great, Olivia waking up because of the church bells !

I want my Olivia back !

And, what host will they find for Bell ?
Will they even find one ?

Oh-OH- Walternate ?

Total = 9, for Lincoln and Anna's interpretation of Bell, but not really the case.

*

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:49 am

The Observer

Spoiler:
 

The Glyphs spelled
Spoiler:
 

About the glyphs,
Spoiler:
 
?

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:49 pm

I thought
Spoiler:
 
as in
Spoiler:
 
... t
Spoiler:
 

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:57 pm

Two contradictory articles on the ratings:
http://www.spoilertv.com/2011/03/fringe-ratings-hit-all-time-low.html
Quote :
Fox’s Fringe fell to its lowest rating ever Friday
night. The drama dropped 13% to 3.8 million viewers and a 1.3 rating in
the adult demo
http://blog.zap2it.com/frominsidethebox/2011/03/tv-ratings-fringe-holds-steady-nbc-wins-the-night.html
Quote :
"Fringe" held on to most of its viewers, averaging 3.7 million, and its demographic ratings were up.
-----it's also March Madness, so a numbers drop could be explained by college basketball tournaments (they bet on it in this country, not legally but still it's huge.)

I persist in hope, Peter will fight to get his Olivia back (guess in two weeks) and everyone will want to see that. The gross-out effect for next week may boost viewers too.

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 6:19 pm



I loved this episode!!! I liked lincoln and peter working together!! it reminded me to bell and walter......brilliant minds working together to solve a case.
the scene where bell told peter about his fate was very telling...if you remember weiss is more into choice while bell believes in fate.Peter doesn't believe in destiny and he thinks walternate won't get peter inside the machine....but we knoe he will power the machine(spoilers)
bell knows more than he tells...maybe next episode he will give us information(3.19).I believe bell is a good man and he cares about the fringe divion but he has a secret agenda for sure. However I don't think sam weiss' agenda and bell's agenda is the same...

grins
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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 6:47 pm

Yes, indeed, Bell talked about fate and destiny, while Sam sayw it's about choice...

I know we're not supposed to trust him (Sam), but right now, I like him better than Bell.

And, I re-re-re-asked the question, is there an alter-Sam ?

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 7:21 pm

lezario wrote:
Yes, indeed, Bell talked about fate and destiny, while Sam sayw it's about choice...

I know we're not supposed to trust him (Sam), but right now, I like him better than Bell.

And, I re-re-re-asked the question, is there an alter-Sam ?


alter sam??? mmmm good question!!! in theory I would say yes ...... but if he is first peole maybehe is like the observers.....they have no alters....

Producers said we will find out in seasin finale
Spoiler:
 
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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 7:28 pm

I mean, even first people should have alters, no ?
The only ones I don't see having alters, are Observers..... well, they might have alters, but in their own dimensions.

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 7:32 pm

We don't know from the spoilers that Peter will power the machine.
We do know from spoilers that the machine "will be activated".

Those two things may or may not be the same.

Since fate and destiny are of equal validity as homeopathy and unicorns, I'm just waiting to get past this part of the story.

It was interesting to see that for all Walter's crocodile tears over what he's done to Olivia in the past, he's not for a moment unwilling to do it to her again, and for a protracted period of time, if he can play with his buddy Bell-------all without, again, any consent, at all, on Olivia's part. Rape, if you will.

I can imagine Peter creating a different universe and spiriting Olivia and him (and Astrid and Broyles and Ella) away to safety from both Blue and Red.

ETA---------- of course he'd have an alt (if he's a first people, if he's people at all).
And if the Observers are beings from within universes, they would too. If they are somethingg "else", that is, not of the universes, then there wouldn't be alts in the same way as creatures from Red or Blue.

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:47 pm

Oh, and what's with the fallen angel biz? I know Azrael is derived from the scapegoat idea, but the story the nun tells is new to me, not based on any apocrypha I am familiar with... probably from a movie or something?

FWIW, Azrael is based on Asael, the scapegoat who carries the people's sins off into the desert... also thought to be based on the same root idea of the bringer of technology...Prometheus... whom we have seen referenced to a lot here.

Science/knowledge=bad, sinful. (Heh, one of the sinful things Azrael brought to humans was cosmetics.)

sigh.

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sun Mar 20, 2011 4:01 am

On Saturday night, Fox replays "Fringe" from the former week, yea! I'm planning to get back online with TIVO in about a month. Getting to catch it again with a good night's sleep was nice!

I'm guessing the 'compassionate soul vampire' gave Joan/vampire more compassion with the viewers. S1's vamp was more gruesome, spinal cord sucking, those teeth on the first season's vampire, she was more 'eewwwwww!'
I like victorian/romantic vampires more than creature/Nosferatu vampires.

She got struck by lightning twice....hmmmm....

"I know when people are scared. You're not scared. Why?"

Having no purpose in life, what a terrible thing to dwell on. When death is inevitable, why hurry it along?

Gene holding Bell's consciousness, and Walter, assigning Astrid milkmaid duties. *chuckling* I don't think I could handle a Walter/Bell mesh. Hmm. Yikes. I'll have to think about that. I missed the whole "soul magnets" explanation, I need to catch up with last week's show. You should have seen me watch the first 5 minutes, I was laughing on and off, a lot!

Having Peter and Lincoln do investigative scenes together, yea! I want Lincoln back!

"ERODE", thanks, Elliot!

"They're doing that finishing sentences for each other thing again."

"Feel free to call me if you need some help."
"Be careful what you wish for." Yeah-Hessssss!

I want Olivia back, too. Watching her do Bell's mannerisms at the kitchen table to Peter, that took me back to drama lab. "That she needed to be here to save those people's lives." scratch scratch "This may be a little more compicated than I first thought." Oh Belly!

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Sun Mar 20, 2011 6:02 am

That scene at the kitchen table---was weird. It was sweet and sad to see Peter's joy when she reappeared, and then it faded when she left......... and the scene let us know Olivia's in danger (no surprise there, the egomaniac had either not tested it out, or................. likely he had tested it out. He was already wearing that armband with the ladder of transmigration on it when he took out Walter's brain parts.

But was that all that scene was for?

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:08 am

...I think Bell wants to con Peter into using the machine; that the Fate crapolini was just that, intended to make him think he must, but that Bell has his own agenda for the machine.

And one more time..... if he spent all that time backing and forthing from one uni to the other, and walter only went and got Peter and came back, surely he's more culpable than Walter?

My suggestion: draw Bell out of Olivia ASAP, into--a dead body and then dump him into the furnace where HIS invention, the shapeshifter, burnt Charlie.

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:02 pm

Quote :
Seriously, if someone who had never watched Fringe tuned in for the first time last week, well, that would be bad. Oh, it was a fun and fine episode (and more proof that Paula Malcomson should continue getting work), but newbies would have laughed their asses off while simultaneously being very confused. Let's just say that having Anna Torv do a sustained impression of Leonard Nimoy is more than just risky -- it's ludicrous. And yet, it was kind of interesting to see in a surreal way. Oh, and new character alert? Hmmm. Anyway, as noted in prior Power Rankings!, Fringe is always entertaining. It's never a wasted hour. And that's a welcome gift on Fridays.
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/bastard-machine/power-rankings-hello-chaos-a-170339

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Thu Sep 22, 2011 6:53 pm

Thursday, Sept. 22nd

I'm rewatching Season 3, starting with Stowaway, 'cause the season was broken up and someone else is watching the prior episodes.

This is the episode where we get to meet this side's Lincoln Lee. We're still stuck with William Bell running around in Olivia's body. This was a creative leap on the writer's part. No matter how much they can make fun and do impressions of Olivia doing William Bell, I applaud the writer's audacity!

This is their second attempt at dealing with vampires, but Dana Gray wasn't exactly a vampire. She didn't steal anyone's consciousness, she was just trying to hitch a ride with a soul to where ever they go after death. Anyway, still like vampire lore if it's done intelligently and I love "Fringe" science, maybe they'll find a good synthesis down the road for another vampire show.

I hope you don't mind me mentioning you, Elliot, but Elliot has told me before she doesn't like pseudoreligion, or ReligionLite. Yes, this certainly falls into ReligionLite, but the story of Dana Gray was sad, sweet, and satisfying to me.

Azrael. This was really in the old testament, or one of those apocrypha that one religion says is real and the others say is folklore?

"The angels took Azreal to God when he had suffered enough. When the angels' collective innocence outweighed Azrael's sin, God allowed Azrael to enter Heaven."

Speaking as a lapsed Methodist, it was so moving to watch Dana. She wanted so badly to go to Heaven, yet she talked 37 people who called the Suicide hotline into living.

I'm a sucker for anyone, male or female, who suffers so well with such great background music.

At first she planned to die with all the others on the train once Brian told her he'd planted a bomb on the train. Too bad we didn't know why Brian felt compelled to do that. Dana did a lovely job trying to prevent Jim from jumping. It makes me wonder sometimes why some people can't pull back from fatalism. We're All going to die. Why rush it?

I'm so glad that Dana took the bomb with her. She got what, 15 yards from it before it exploded. An ordinary person might die from the percussion, but Dana Gray should have been able to walk away. But she needed to be there to save those people on the train, this was her destiny. Then she was able to die.

The destiny thing. It almost doesn't matter what denomination you are, plenty of Judeo-Christian religions still have arguments on whether there's destiny or not. I think it's a cop out, that you only have one chance, that everything happens because of your choices. I'm still open to believing the Destiny thing. It's a stuggle, though. It's easy to say, I didn't get farther in life because this is my destiny.

"One of these things is not like the other" I missed it the first time. He says it again in the Season 4 premiere. The childhood question may be a Lincoln catchphrase.

Back to rewatching Season Three. Is it Friday evening yet?


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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:29 pm

It's cute seeing Peter disdain William Bell, then be all warm when he recognizes Olivia. At least he catches the short time when Olivia breaks through.

So Dana Gray's magnetism becomes so strong that her body can't be torn apart physically because she was struck by lightening twice. That's going to be hard to replicate.

"I know this sounds insane. But I don't think this woman can die."

Whoops! You just graduated to the Fringe Divison, uptight FBI agent!



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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:58 pm

I agree, Fate is bunk. It's not even pseudoscience, to misquote Peter Bishop. And it's rather lame of Fringe to spend so much time with it, but it's one of Pinkner's hobbyhorses I think.......... that or focus group polling says the audience they want believes in it.

As long as they don't harp on it all the time, I'll look at the scenery and the acting, and ignore it. I thought the whole concept of the woman who couldn't die because she was out of sync with her fate was enough Fatey Fate for one season, but the acting in the episode was good and at least they stopped short of making it all about angels and demons; you watch the Vamp stuff, Cathy, was it a nod to that audience?

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:29 am

Sure, it might be a nod to the vampire audience. "Midnight" tried to mix vampire lore as fringe science, but she was more a Nosferatu kind of vampire.

Vampires are supposed to be as irresistable as they are dangerous. Think Colin Farrell. I need to see the new "Fright Night", I saw the old one with Chris Sarandon. A very clever reworking of "Rear Window".

"Stowaway" was more about angels than vampires. They came up with a dandy of a vampire theory though, didn't they? (checking IMDB) Paula Malcolmson was so compelling as Dana Gray.

The story of Azrael was beautiful. The angels going for Azrael even though God forbade it. I doubt we see any "Fringe" angel stories, I can't think of a logical background.

Digressing, Christopher Walken did a trio of movies called "Prophesy" about angels warring on earth with humans getting caught in the crosshairs. I started watching the movie prepared to feel bad for him. And got s****d into the other two sequels! They were fun trashy movies! *thumbs up*
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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Fri Sep 23, 2011 3:32 am

The angel thing seemed stuffed in all crosswise, and so I wondered if it was there not for the storyline but for the callout to another demographic.

I've never seen the attraction in Farrell, but I did see the attraction in Boreanaz (NOT MARSTERS! ) and in that guy on the shortlived Vampire/crime solving show.

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PostSubject: Re: 3x17 "Stowaway" - Episode Discussion   Fri Sep 23, 2011 9:59 am

"that guy on the shortlived vampire/crime solving show" was my introduction into fan websites. It was called "Moonlight", they broadcast the year that the writers' strike happened. It was agonizing trying to will CBS to give it another chance.
It got abysmal reviews, but the fanbase was dedicated!

I even went to LA for the first Moonlight fan gathering the week CBS was going to announce renewal or cancellation.
It was a bittersweet conference, the couple of hundred people who were there got to commiserate the cancellation and watch the last episode together.

Alex O'Loughlin went on to "Hawaii 5-0", and I went on to "Fringe". grins I liked him much better in the vampire show, but Hawaii 5-0 gets much better ratings. Such is life!

I've been playing on YouTube this week, obviously because of the amount of clips!

Here's your David Boranez, smile http://youtu.be/S_3uExOLzbw

15 hours to go before Fringe comes back on, yea!
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